Posted by Merticus 2.26.07 2:08amVoices Of The Vampire Community
02.24.07 Meeting Transcript<Merticus> Aki - logs can start
* AkiFeather nods
<Merticus> Sent her two e-mails.
<Gabex> nods
* Gabex is now known as Gabrielx
<Merticus> Ok welcome to the VVC public meeting for February 24, 2007. Thank you to everyone who has shown up this evening.
* Gabrielx is now known as Gabriel
<Merticus> Assuming everyone knows everyone else at present. As we do not have new members present we can commence with the schedule for tonight.
<Gabriel> nods
<Merticus> First, we'd like to reinterate that the VVC is not the only group of its kind out there nor does it assert itself and the end-all gathering of leaders or known persons in the communityt o come together and discuss community affairs, etc.
<Merticus> More representative of multiple groups, paths, beliefs, and segments of the VC who meet and are able to put aside personal differences, strife, and other differences of opinons to work together to discuss, suggest, and formulate projects/ideas/etc. that help to improve the VC in general.
<Merticus> Just so there is no confusion as to our intent and purpose for meeting.
<Gabriel> And no confusion outside of us, as people in the community seem to be thinking this was an end all is all "leadership council"
<AncientKhan> noted
<Merticus> Anyone care to add anything to that or further clarify for those who may have questions at a future date?
<Gabriel> in our eyes
<AncientKhan> nothing to add
<Lono676767> I agree
<Gabriel> This is open to anyone who actually wants to step up and say I'd like to join, Of course problematic's will be weighed but this is for a betterment and a more communicative community
<Gabriel> "is that a word?"
<Gabriel> :p
* Lady has joined #VVC
* Lono676767 adds it to the gabeism dictionary
<LadyCG> I do hope we're leaving the potential to become a larger and more influencial group, since that would lead to a more cohesive community as a whole
<AkiFeather> hold
<Gabriel> lady: whome may you be if you don't mind?
<AncientKhan> Is that like a Yogism?
<Merticus> Ok onto the discussion regarding Vampirefreaks and a followup to our concerns on two fronts... the violence perpetuated by and inflicted upon members of VF in the past, including but not limited to the slaying of a member who recently went to meet an individual offline that received very little coverage if any by VF.
* Gabriel sets mode: +i
* Lady has left #VVC
<Gabriel> ok if anyone else wants in they'll need to ask sorry for that slip continue
<Merticus> Ok
<Gabriel> lady: we would like that yes.. no matter creed, race, religion, or path.. it's about coming together not 'uniting' but communicating our thoughts opinions and ideals with one another for like or dislike
* Gabriel nods to merticus
<LadyCG> I have a rather dim view of VF.. I don't mind saying so.. I live near the city of Medicine Hat Alberta.. Pagans and Vampires here used to be left pretty much along till the incident involveing the 12 year old girl and that guy who killed her family here.
<Lono676767> I think most of us within the Community are concerned about the safety of our members, however
<Merticus> Basically concerns regarding VF were along the lines of 1.) Not giving proper attention to the fact that a member of theirs was murdered or extensive safety posting on their site. And that there continues to be a clear divide in public perception over VF as relating to the real vampire community rather than merely a social Gothic site for others to gather.
<Raine> I will share my opinions along with the rest of you, though whatever the consensus is, as I mentioned on the forum, I will be willing to contact Jet and speak with him about it.
<Lono676767> VF has drawn alot of unneeded negative publicity, that has even a fruitbat concerned
<Gabriel> actually slow for a moment
<Gabriel> raine
<Merticus> Basically the media taking the name and placing assumptions on our own culture and assigning to us a stigma of violence, unethical treatment of others, etc.
* Lono676767 shakes his head and mutters "damn small keyboard"
<Gabriel> can you tell us his viewpoints on VF? since you know the 'owner' I'm guessing?
<Gabriel> where does his mind stand in all of this besides stats, and in relation to the vampire community if you know
<AncientKhan> I made my points in the open letter on the forum, so I shant rehash, lest it's needed.
* Gabriel nods to khan
<Merticus> Well everyone convey their viewpoints on the matter. Like to hear Raine's perspective.
<Raine> Jet makes his living though VF, and with that, is able to support his family, so to him, it is more that just a community, it is his livelihood
<Sylvere> BRB, guys. Spyder needs my help.
* Sylvere is now known as Sylvere_AFK
<Sanguinarius> I'm kinda here
<Ravena> well, that could go two ways, he could only care about money since the site is his living
<Raine> I would venture to say that he will not respond to any demands regarding the site (not that we would take such actions) but I am hoping that , if approaced reasonably with a letter from the community, he will at least hear our worries with an open mind
<Ravena> or he could care that the site doesn't go downhill because he'll lose money
<Sanguinarius> I plan to read the log when nobody is around to bother me
<Ravena> I don't know which one it is
<Lono676767> lol Sangi
* TwistedThorns is now known as TTafk
<TTafk> bbiab folks...
* Sylvere_AFK is now known as Sylvere
<Sylvere> Back.
<Gabriel> raine: that's what we want to offer a reasonabile middle
<Merticus> Where does he stand on issues related to the VC as a whole and media attention given to VF that inadvertently casts a negative light on us when nearly 100% of the time no one from the actual VC has anything to do with the events transpiring.
<Gabriel> wb syl
<Raine> Well he has already issued a statement about the dangers online with such a site, so apart from our concerns, he is looking out for his own community
<Gabriel> does he have a disclaimer on signup? does he have an age limit 18 and up so that more intellectual choices of meeting can be made?
<Gabriel> is that disclaimer in relation to dangers of online?
<Merticus> Do you think he'd be willing to make a safety/clarification/disclaimer statement part of VF for future account sign-ups?
<LadyCG> The girl here who killed her family was 12... and had a profile
<Ravena> and her bf was like 23 or something
<Sylvere> Could we possibly get him to put a disclaimer on his site that states its purpose and that it is not in any way connected to the VC?
<Ravena> so he was a pedo and a killer
<Raine> the age limit is 13
<LadyCG> yes Ravena
<Gabriel> sylvere: that would be awesome
<LadyCG> its been VERY hard on the Vamp community here. **sighs.. we used to be very open.. but now.. we can't be, because the public is associating our community with what when one. its been very bad here
<LadyCG> .. yes I'm a little bitter
<Gabriel> I mean, it's really bad that this has become something for the VC to really worry about..
<Sylvere> You know, most sites like Meetup.com and Myspace require members to be at least 13. I know there's no way to police that but at least he could make it a requirement.
<Merticus> Yes, such a statement could potentially go a long way... a clear statement of what the purpose of "vampirefreaks" is as a social site driven by revenue and chat/blog community - not representative of the beliefs of modern vampirism.
<AncientKhan> Does anyone find it plausible he would add a disclaimer distancing himself from the VC with a name like vampirefreaks?
<AkiFeather> That sounds like a good idea
<Gabriel> sylv: it is 13 on VF
<LadyCG> I would sure lov eit Khan, if he would
<Raine> there is a definate age limit, which is enforced to the best of his ability, but that can only go so far
* Gabriel nods to raine
<LadyCG> I'd love to see the VC distances from VF
<Imon> I doubt he'll do that
<LadyCG> distanced, even
<Merticus> Short of changing the name nothing would ever be "perfect", however, a statement on record to use in times of these events would be nice from a media/public standpoint.
<AncientKhan> It would be nice, but i don't think he'd shoot himself in the foot like that.
* Gabriel nods to merticus
<Gabriel> which comes to the question
<Gabriel> DOES he consider VF apart of the community
<Gabriel> ?
<Sylvere> The RPG community has made efforts to distance themselves from us just as we have from them. I don't know why he wouldn't.
<Gabriel> that's been the weighing question
<Lono676767> thats a good question
<Imon> besides he's going to say what constitutes the VC?
<Anshar> If he places a disclaimer on the site that says "Vampire Freaks is not associated with the Vampire Community", that has two effects... one, it looks oxymoronic, two it places him in a potential situation where he may lose revenue and interest in his site.
<LadyCG> .. alternatively.. maybe WE need to find a way to distance the VC from the VF...
<Raine> he has nothing to do with the vampire community, but at the same time, he would not change the name of the site
<Merticus> There are only a handful of actual self-identifying real vampire "cults" on VF at the moment, the lionshare is rp or composed of kids who could not honestly even define "vampire" in a modern context.
* Anshar nods to Raine
<Gabriel> raine: wouldn't ask to change the name
<Gabriel> that's his lively hood
<Gabriel> personally
<Lono676767> lol mert
<Raine> there are some members of our community on tVF, but it is no different than those of us with a myspace page
* Gabriel grins at merticus
<Anshar> okay, here's a thought, if I may...
<Raine> *VF
<Sylvere> We could ask him to define the VC as it is on ReligiousTolerance.org.
<Merticus> No, definately not advocating anything that would cut into revenues for him.
* Gabriel nods to mert
<Anshar> what if we started a cult on VF that had its own requirements for entry? (this is me trying to make a suggestion that works WITH the way his site works, not against it)
<Sylvere> No, because then we are DEFINITELY associated with VF.
<Anshar> ugh. I just used the word cult in a sentence. *sits back down*
<Sylvere> No way, forget it, not gonna happen.
<Anshar> lol yes, I see that now
<Raine> that would just make one more cult among many others
<Gabriel> yeah I'm not even going to let that one roll around my brain cells
<AncientKhan> I think that's counterproductive, Anshar. no disrespect, mind you.
<Lono676767> then we ourlseves would be...exactly syl
<Anshar> seemed a lot clearer in my head, glad I put it down on paper so you could tell me why it was flawed.
<LadyCG> I agree with Syl... unles we want to take on the responsibility of educating the VF crowd about REAL vampirism.. we'd just be advocating the site
<Gabriel> lol
* Anshar nods
<Anshar> yea, you're right, absolutely
<Merticus> There are two cults in operation (actually 3) that discuss real vampirism at the moment - but yes, I agree "cult" itself is a poor term to use for a group of that kind. And would not accomplish a separation by any means.
<Anshar> very true.
<Raine> we should not waste our time with making VF understand our community, as most members could care less
<Lono676767> true
<Gabriel> So should we take the time in seperation from our side?
<Anshar> it just seems like every approach is so "murky" in so many ways
<Merticus> Exactly CG, it's not out job to educate those on VF.
<Raine> exactly gabe
<Gabriel> because two letters go just the same
<Gabriel> we can point media to OUR letters
<Gabriel> but to be on the safe side
<AncientKhan> I have no qualms with members of the VC being members, but I think it's manditory we "nut up" and start differentiating ourselves from those who wish to be from those that are.
<Gabriel> I would think it be nice to at least ask for a seperation letter
<Gabriel> if he denies it
<Gabriel> then so be it
* Anshar nods
<Sylvere> Sounds like I need to get the RVCA incorporated asap. The only problem is, I don't have the $$ for the fees and I still don't have a budget plan.
<LadyCG> we could, theoretically, issue our own disclaimers on our own sites saying we are not related to that site, I supposed...
<Gabriel> sylv: were actually working on the INC of LH rightnow
<Sylvere> kewl
<Gabriel> should be done in 190 days
<AncientKhan> I think that's a good start, CG.
<Gabriel> if you need any info let me know
<Gabriel> we went to a seminar
<Raine> we should definately make our own disclaimers, and perhaps SUGGEST some to jet as well
<Anshar> right CG, but the people who we would actually be concerned about associating us with them are also the same people who wouldn't bother to read a notice.
* Anshar nods
<Anshar> it can't hurt.
<Sylvere> The Inc is cheap. It's the 501c3 that costs the big bucks.
<Merticus> I'd start with a letter asking for a seperation/clarification of VC to the VF. If no go, then work on methods to further distance the VC from VF - be it through banners, internal letters, forum statements, etc.
<Raine> beyond that, I'm not sure what else would be realistic or fair
<Gabriel> nod we estimated 1k
<Lono676767> I like that Idea ladycg
<Gabriel> total
<Gabriel> we have to file Ca as well as fed.. "anyhow we'll talk about that later"
<Sylvere> Gabe: I think the Feds want $250
<AncientKhan> Have we moved on?
<Merticus> Quite the number of forums out there - could contact the admins of each and see their individual interest in issuing a disclaimers or something we could draft regarding VF.
<LadyCG> we have a few sites represented here.. if we were to encourage the trend to post dislaimers on Real Vamp sites that say we are not associated with the VF which is a Goth Community, it could get the word out in time
<AkiFeather> Merticus: that would be a good idea
<Gabriel> All I can see is most of the VC is fed up with hearing "yet another killing from VF's forum" --"Are Vampires ruthless cult driven killers?"
<Gabriel> in the headlines
<Sanguinarius> plz excuse me, I am now having a personal crtisis of someone else's problems...
<Sylvere> Let's get some banners up that are anti-VF
* Sanguinarius is now known as Sangi_afk
<Gabriel> I think going "anti-VF" is bad taste
<Sangi_afk> and I'm very pissed right now so I'm afk for a while
<AkiFeather> nods gabe
<LadyCG> I dont' know about anti VF.. but maybe more PRO VC? lol
<Gabriel> I think drawing a line of seperation is better taste
<Sylvere> Gabe: I'm not sure it's any worse than the anti-RPG banners
<AkiFeather> just banners or statements that will shw the VC doesn't support VF
<Raine> pro vc is much better
* Anshar nods to gabe
<Gabriel> if anyone goes ANTI anything the anything part gains more attention
<Merticus> Basically the body count on VF is too high and it's negatively affecting the perception, potential well being, and peace of mind for the real vampire community.
<AncientKhan> I think before we start a VF flame war, wouldn't it be prudent to contact Jet?
<Gabriel> ancient thats what I said earlier
<Gabriel> let him have his say
<Sylvere> I'm not saying trash VF just something that says something like "No VF Zone" or something.
<Gabriel> if it's "screw em"
<Gabriel> then
<AncientKhan> perhaps, even invite him here for a one-time meeting/
<Gabriel> well
<LadyCG> Yes, I agree Khan.. but I don't think we have to be Anti VF, to accomplish what we need
<Gabriel> it's left in our hands
<AkiFeather> nods
<Raine> we should draft a letter, I'll do my best to get it to him, and whatever haoppens from there may determine what we do or don't do
<Imon> I am still unclear on whether VF currently has safety warnings on their site?
<Gabriel> raine: letter drafting HAS started
<Merticus> Yes, no reason for it to be a negative campaign - just more a statement of fact/strong opinion from the VC about the VC and the general feeling on the matter.
<Gabriel> imon: yeah that was never answered
<Gabriel> I'm not a VFer
<Gabriel> so I dunno
<Gabriel> wow that sounded bad :S
<LadyCG> banners on our site such as "This is a Real Vampire Community" and in tiny letters underneath the disclaimer: (not related to Vampire Freaks Goth Community)
<AkiFeather> especially since you can find members of the VC on VF
<Gabriel> agreed merticus
<AkiFeather> that makes sense Lady CG
<Raine> perhaps we should turn our discussion to what we put in the letter
<Merticus> Jet did issue a statement in brief regarding safety a few weeks back on the blog/news section. Best judgement, etc.
<Imon> that would seem to me to be a first priority and yes contacting him first would be appropriate imo
<AncientKhan> If I may...
<Gabriel> making a hate war is complete Bs , and honestly should be against what we think as we all are open to others opinions beliefs.. etc.. BUT bringing up seperation and saftey is in my opinion .. responsible
<Lono676767> I actually do like the disclaimer idea cg, however I think there should be a way to perhaps, recongnize member sites of the ovc.
<Imon> nods to Mert...but that's not as good as being like permanently on the main page
<Merticus> Seperation and advocation of safety and discretion.
<Gabriel> raine: I think all the things we've discussed.. asking for seperation, maybe saftey advocation on the signup page
<Imon> or with sign up although few people read terms of agreement when signing up for stuff like that
<Gabriel> that's a LARGE step
<Gabriel> in the right direction
<Ravena> like a little icon or whatever.. but we don't want to be mistaken for a sanguinarium type organization
<AncientKhan> I believe before any public mention of VF, we need to have a discussion with Jet. I know the idea is a bit prolonged, but i'd hate to mess with a person's income if it isn't necessary.
<Ravena> only because we aren't one
<Merticus> No, something permanent or part of the disclaimer or sign-up statement would be much better for Jet to issue.
<Gabriel> imon: it won't stop the problem.. but it'll give us a way to point and go look.... it says they don't advocate being apart of the Real vampire community
<Raine> he already made a statement on safety, dso the only thing more he could do was to make it more permanent and visible
<Sylvere> I think a permanent disclaimer on the main page is the best option.
<Gabriel> I'd like to stop the problem but we can't.. he can't..
<Gabriel> we know this
<Merticus> Agree
<Gabriel> raine: exactly
<Gabriel> all we'd be asking him is
<Raine> perhaps as part of that he could mention that he is not affiliated with the vampire community and leave it at that
<Gabriel> basically generousity, to help us out
<Gabriel> and blanket us from issues that stem
<Sylvere> Could we get him to include a link to ReligiousTolerance.org's definition of the VC as part of the disclaimer?
<Raine> is there anything we can offer him in return?
<Merticus> Well keep in mind nothing is blanket across the board but definately would help.
<AncientKhan> I sincerely doubt he will publicly distance himself from the comunity. That is the initail lure, from a business standpoint.
<LadyCG> yes.. we won't start plastering anti VF banners everywhere? **chuckles and grins evilly... hows that for incentitive?
<Sylvere> LOL
<Sylvere> I agree with CG
<Raine> fair, but more of a threat than an incentive
<Lono676767> lol CG
<Sylvere> We could, potentially, hurt his revenue if he refuses.
<Gabriel> we wont be on live TV denouncing?
<Gabriel> jk
* TTafk is now known as TwistedThorns
<LadyCG> well... there are carrots and there are sticks...
<AncientKhan> Expecting him to claim Vampirefreaks is not a vampire site, is like disney claiming to not really being a magic kingdom.
<Lono676767> lol...never say that to a person in the tv biz Razz
<Gabriel> sorry that was a bad statement
<Gabriel> honestly raine nothing I can think of
<Sylvere> We should offer a choice between something positive and something negative.
<AkiFeather> wb Twisted
<TwistedThorns> thank you
<AncientKhan> w/b, Twist
<Gabriel> but what he can do is help another community who's trying to be more stable.. as well, the VC people who are on there will probably stay longer
<AkiFeather> Yes it's always easier to offer options otherwise the person will feel backed into a corner...
<LadyCG> exactly... he has choices.. he can at least try and work with it or force us to separate the issues ourselves.. that isnt' a threat, its just a fact of how things work
<Gabriel> it's more of a one sided thing sorry to say
<Gabriel> but if he has any actual caring
<Gabriel> he'll see it
<Lono676767> hopefully he can see our perspective on things
<Raine> so we need to make clear in this letter that we are NOT threatening
<Gabriel> and help
<Merticus> Could always attempt to work with the VC people on VF to encourage such... though not sure how much help that would be.
<Gabriel> I don't think saying "We wont hurt your revenue" is the way to go
<Gabriel> I think it should play off his morals
<Gabriel> personally
<Sylvere> He doesn't have any.
<LadyCG> were we not going to invite Mikayla in to this group anyway? isn't she VC?
<Merticus> Yes, take the high road.
<Ravena> I think it's more of a matter of them being more aware and having a reporting system when people post about shooting up their school, and then following through with it
<AncientKhan> I would STRONGLY discourage actual vampires attempting to educate from within his site.
<Gabriel> lady: we decided Webb firs
<Ravena> by banning the person and reporting to the authorities if necessary
<Gabriel> t
<LadyCG> right!
<Merticus> Khan, yes, however it's already being done on a small scale.
<Ravena> instead of trying to sit back and "be cool"
<LadyCG> sorry gabe.. you know brain like seive
<Ravena> he's a grownup, not some goth kid
<AncientKhan> If that's the case, merticus, then we have no right to bitch about VF being linked to us.
<Ravena> if they had a reporting system in place and used it and took the appropriate steps with said report, I wouuldn't be as opposed to the site
<AncientKhan> Because, in fact, vampires are trying to affect and interact with the same folks we're trying to discourage.
<Lono676767> what tpye of reporting system?
<Ravena> "report this post"
<Lono676767> ahh
<Merticus>
http://vampirefreaks.com/cult/Sanguivores<AncientKhan> brb
<Merticus> One cult that links to sites within the VC.
<Ravena> with the rules saying don't post about how you're going to kill your family or shoot up your school or whatever" and "don't post pictures of you with illegal guns..or drugs.. etc"
<Merticus>
http://vampirefreaks.com/cult/Vampirism - the other site that does the same.
<Ravena> if the post warrants it they then forward the info they have to the authorities, who are qualified to investigate
<Merticus> It's a potential issue that could arise, therefore, probably should be looked at beforehand.
<Raine> the actual VC population on VF I would guess to be only abot 5 % if that much
<LadyCG> Ok.. i"m sorry I have got to ask.. who the hell came up with the term "Sanguivores" **shudders (being Sang and all)
<Gabriel> shrug..
<Gabriel> I think the point is.. raine will ask for those two things.. raine thinks he'll say shove it.. at that point we just make open letters to the community
<Gabriel> sound about right?
<AncientKhan> Sorry for the brief departure. had a little one to tuck in.
<Merticus> 5% even would be a very high estimate, though not sure what position those "cults" would take if the VC were to issue such a seperation... should we continue with contacting Jet, asking for such, and then seeing where we're at from his reply?
<LadyCG> I don't see honestly see any other options, Gabe
<Imon> brb too family
<LadyCG> unless we actually want to bring our Media contacts into this
<Gabriel> the "Cults" on VF will have to deal
<Gabriel> and understand the betterments of community
<Gabriel> I mean imo
<Sylvere> OMG! Sanguivorous has links to Sphynxie's site, Sanguinarius.org, and DDD. We are so fucked.
<Raine> sounds about right, though I'm hoping my silver tongue will worjk to our advantage
<Gabriel> Sylv: nah
<Merticus> Yes, they do Sylvere and discuss some of those in VC as well.
<Raine> god damn I cant type today
<LadyCG> **empathizes with Raine on the no type
<AncientKhan> This has all the makings of a monkey fucking a football.
<Merticus> I've give the quality of the conversations as poor at best but then again I'm not one to pass judgement.
<Gabriel> khan: does the football win?
<AncientKhan> always
<AncientKhan> Unless it gets popped.
<Lono676767> khan, I just had a visual there, ..never, ever say that again....
<Merticus> Ok well to wrap this issue up... has everyone stated their opinions?
<Raine> The VC cults on VF would be more appropriate to ask non-affiliation statements from
<Merticus> Anything else someone hasn't said regarding VF, statement of seperation/clarification, cults, etc.?
<AncientKhan> Duly noted, Lono.
<Gabriel> raine: I think JET, and them
<Gabriel> if they wish to affiliate with VF, then state "under the understanding VF is not VC related, here are sites that are"
<Gabriel> that's on them
<Merticus> Agrees with Raine... Sangi/Sphynx/Memory need to speak with SpikeJonez or we with them and see if they wish to have their links affiliated with those cults.
<Raine> I can have kai speak with spike, I believe they are well aquainted
<Merticus> Because right now - those are the major cults discussing vampirism on VF and in the event something happens on VF the media will go to those cults and then to those web links for followup on the VC.
<Gabriel> ok mert so whats the end note on the subject?
<Raine> spike, from what I've heard, would be very reasonable with our requests
<Merticus> Well if everyone has said their peace we can put a couple things to a vote...
<Gabriel> ok
* Anshar is now known as Anshar_BriefAfk
<LadyCG> If it does come to a point where we need to do the separating from VF and go with banners... (which is something we've discussed on S&M before) dos the VVC have a logo yet for affiliated communities?
<AncientKhan> My piece is retired for tonight.
<Gabriel> that'll be discussed in a bit cg
<LadyCG> OK
<Imon> back sorry
<Merticus> 1.) All those who agree that Raine should contact Jet and ask him to issue a permanent safety statement on the main site/part of new member singup and a statement of seperation from the VC vote yes or no.
<AncientKhan> Aye
<AkiFeather> yes
<Gabriel> aye
<Raine> aye
<TwistedThorns> yes
<Imon> yes
<Lono676767> yes
<Sylvere> hell yes
<Merticus> yes
<LadyCG> yes
<Merticus> Vote on measure carries.
<AncientKhan> *adding the non-affiliation statement out
<Merticus> Raine, can you take care of such?
<Ravena> yes
<Raine> lets take a week to draft a final letter on our forum, and I'll do what I can as soon as it's done
<Merticus> 2.) That SpikeJonez should be contacted/sites that listed on those cults and clarify "affiliation" etc.? Yes or No
<Gabriel> nods
<Merticus> Raine - ok
<Gabriel> agreed raine
<Sylvere> yes
<AncientKhan> Agreed on #2
<Gabriel> aye
<LadyCG> Yes
<Raine> yes
<TwistedThorns> yes
<Merticus> yes
<AkiFeather> yes
<Lono676767> yes
<Imon> yes
<Ravena> yes
<Merticus> Ok 2nd measure carries
<Raine> I can manage spike immediately
<Merticus> Thank you Raine
<Merticus> Onto next topic now.
<Gabriel> since we've been looking at the saftey of others
<Gabriel> ;p
<Gabriel> time to toss the coin
<Gabriel> ?
<Gabriel> ;p
<Merticus> Proposal for a "safety guide for the community" - essentially along the
<Merticus> lines of the Black Veil, however, a more specific accounting of what practices,
<Merticus> decisions, and behaviors are conducive to keeping one safe when out in public,
<Merticus> clubs, choosing donors, and in general as relates to vampirism.
<LadyCG> thats not a guide.. its a book
<Sylvere> agreed
<Lono676767> lol
<AkiFeather> lol
<Merticus> Basically an overall - how to conduct yourself in and out of the community without ending up in the paper or on the news...
<AncientKhan> I will emphatically say, "NO"
<Sylvere> There are lots of versions of Safety Guides out there. I wrote one myself.
<LadyCG> Haven't we been doing this very thing for years?
<Ravena> I think the info is already out there
<Ravena> I have written several articles on safety
<Merticus> Anyone ever put it together on a larger scale publicly?
<LadyCG> I even cover some safety info in my book
<Merticus> Aside from out local forums, books, articles, etc.
<Ravena> mine are all on my site
<AncientKhan> You can't legislate common sense. Rather than trying to tell people what to do, we need to be examples to follow. A guide is cheap.
<Gabriel> A Simplified version
<Ravena> how else would you put them out?
<Lono676767> same
<Sylvere> I also wrote "Ethical Guidelines" along the same lines as the BV with the input of several members of the community years ago.
<Merticus> ie: something that can be cited or others can go to in simple form - yea what Gabe said.
<Raine> I think we should take care of this on an individual level: it's mostly common sense, the problem is that not everyone has it, and no guide will change that unfortunately
<Gabriel> like "13 rules of Saftey" ---Not that bad-- just saying
<LadyCG> you can make things downloadable for free on Lulu
<Gabriel> not everyone follows the black veil, but most all have read it and know about it
<Merticus> Ok then if everyone agrees enough material is already out there then should we make it more visible on our forums/sites/etc.?
<AncientKhan> *runs around pulling hair out*
<Sylvere> We did talk with Michelle about doing another version of the BV so that it would be more realistic and more clear.
<LadyCG> IF we could come to a consensus on what we would want to say.. getting it out there is the easy part
<Sylvere> Whatever happened to that?
<Gabriel> she's working on it
<Merticus> Khan - state your opinions
<Sylvere> We
<Ravena> info is in plain view on my site and a lot of my articles are also on other sites
<Sylvere> aack
<LadyCG> my concern would be what material do we cover and how do we come to an agreement on what it will cover and what it will recomend?
<Lono676767> like mine Razz
<Gabriel> how about Minors should be occompaied by an adult while meeting another. (Still applies if the other is an adult)
* Sylvere hauls out the eraser *scrubbityscrubbity*
<Raine> What are we considering a minor?
<AkiFeather> nods... always have a companion no matter who you are
<AkiFeather> lol
<AncientKhan> Here's my point: telling people how to have common sense is insane. If addressed personally, suggestions are good. but if you put out a "be-all, end-all" rule book, it will go the same place your DMV driving pamphlet went when you got your driver's liscence. We need to be personnaly accountable rather than trying to issue a blanket statement.
<Merticus> So does everyone think this issue should best be left to local community, houses, forums, sites, etc. - no public document that is visible to the public?
<Lono676767> ahh the buddy system
<Gabriel> nods drop minor out since it's relative
<Gabriel> ancient: having a saftey label on a blow dryer "Do not use while in shower" is insane
<LadyCG> is there even ONE us who has a site who doesn't already preach this stuff night and day?
<AkiFeather> but somebody's done it else it wouldn't be on there lol
<Sylvere> We're never going to "legislate morality" for the community but we can offer up some common sense guidelines for people who are new or not familiar with us. Like Michelle pointed out, the BV is out there and outsiders look at it as our "laws."
<Lono676767> true gabe but it does protect the hair dyer company from being sued
<Imon> I just think there's enough good information out there, why put a huge amount of energy of this group into reinventing the wheel?
<AncientKhan> Exactly my point. You can't tell people to use common sense if they don't have it and expect it to work.
<Imon> and what will be tedious getting so many to agree on the semantics?
* LadyCG agrees with Imon
<Merticus> Doubt it, though I'm sure somewhere people claim we promote a dangerous lifestyle or promote behavior that can endanger young kids... which is bunk of course as we all know.
<TwistedThorns> it would be a headache for all to try and compile this to fit everyone's preferences in wording etc
<Gabriel> ok well I'm still going to do one for my site
<LadyCG> It could be done.. the question becomes... does it NEED to be done?
<Gabriel> if you guys have done enough then you have
<Sylvere> Imon: do you remember the GVN?
<Gabriel> were asking VF to put a disclaimer on their site that should be common sense
<Gabriel> are we?
<Imon> yes although I waasn't actually in that group
<Ravena> if I combined all of my articles that would pretty much constitute a guide
<Lono676767> yes I have a disclaimer on my site, and some common sense codes of conduct as well.
<Merticus> Well it would be impossible to represent everyone's views into something "simple" - nightmare scenario if it were to delve deep into specific line item instructions..
<Ravena> no harm though in people making something for their own site
<Sylvere> Ok, so you remember Blackheart and the group he started to write the Vampire Advice Document?
<AncientKhan> No, Gabe, this is different. Many going to VF think it's a site for vampires. That's false advertising, vice how to live one's life.
<Imon> yep I do
<LadyCG> I say it ca't hurt for there to be a guide for the community, so that sites who are not up to creating thier own, will still have safety info they can put up, and know its good advice...
<AncientKhan> I do, too.
<Sylvere> Writing the Ethical Guidelines wasn't that hard.
<LadyCG> but does something like that already exist in the community we can use?
<Merticus> Prob. a dozen versions that exist...
<Sylvere> Everyone talked about what they wanted to see and I turned it into a cohesive whole.
<Merticus> Lay them out side by side and see what themes run through each?
<Gabriel> either way you guys agree'd its a bad idea
<AncientKhan> I still say ethics are addressed on a one to one basis.
<Sylvere> I have the one I wrote years ago. I can post it on base001.
<Merticus> Or is Sylvere has her copy handy...
<Imon> no it's not hard but then a final version was never reached either..it petered out...yes you're the only one who actually finished for your site
<LadyCG> then maybe we need to just take a look at what we already have and see if there is one we can endorse.
<LadyCG> would that save us from reinventing the wheel?
<Lono676767> what if we all posted what he are using on our sites on base..and compare
<Ravena> I'm not opposed to us doing one - but I have enough on my plate atm
<Merticus> Is it short enough to post some here? See if at least in the ballpark?
<LadyCG> that would be a logical way to go about it, Lono
<Sylvere> Does everyone want to see the one I wrote on Base?
<LadyCG> I do
<Imon> sure post it
<AncientKhan> I'll pass, though not to be disrespectful.
<Sylvere> No worries, K.
<Ravena> I'll read it if you post it
<AncientKhan> Thank you.
<LadyCG> If we get a few people to post theirs then maybe we can find a more than one good one that might suit more than one type of board
<Merticus> Well start a thread on base and each person who wrote something along those lines post and perhaps we can bring up at next meeting or attempt to put them together in a modern revision. Or check with Michelle and she where she is at on the rewrite.. though the two concepts are different in some respects.
<Sylvere> I'll post it after the meeting. Michelle included it in the Vampire Voices anthology too so it will be out there for a wider audience sometime this year, I think.
<Gabriel> don't worry
<Gabriel> quickfox
<Gabriel> doesn't have flood protection on ;p
<Ravena> I prefer to write my own material if I were to post something on my site.. but my own new domain won't be launched for another few months at least
* Gabriel nods sylvere
<LadyCG> **perks up ears.. Ravena is launching a new domain?
<Gabriel> nods
<LadyCG> very cool! Congratulations
<AncientKhan> I will respectfully disagree with the group and abstain from therest of this topi.
<AncientKhan> Congrats, ravenna.
* Anshar_BriefAfk is now known as Anshar
<Ravena> yes, but still have quite a bit of work to do
* TwistedThorns is now known as TTafk
<Ravena> thanks Smile
<LadyCG> Fair enough, Khan.
<Ravena> that way gabe will have more room on his site for his pretty flower pic collection Wink
<LadyCG> I know how that is.. my new boards are still a graphical mess, lol.
<Merticus> Ok to recap this topic then... 3.) We are posting out own respective ethical tenets/suggestions/guidelines/etc. on the base to review at a later date and will table this idea for later? Yes or No?
<Sylvere> yes
<LadyCG> yes
* Lono676767 watches khan, as he rocks back and forth pulling his hair in an attempt to find his "happy place"
<AncientKhan> I abstain.
<Raine> "or"
<Merticus> yes
<Gabriel> yes
<Anshar> yes
<Lono676767> sure
<Merticus> Other votes on this?
<Ravena> yes
<AkiFeather> yes
<Imon> neutral
<Merticus> Ok 2 abstain, 8 yes
* Gabriel pets khan and gives him japanese booze
<AkiFeather> lol
<Merticus> Those who have them post them and we'll talk further on base as everyone sees fit.
<LadyCG> Saki alla round?
<AkiFeather> noo not saki ^_^
<Gabriel> hehe
* AkiFeather grins at khan
<Merticus> Which is a great segway into the next topic...
<AncientKhan> Man, could I use some shojyu after this topic...
* Gabriel nods to merticus
<AncientKhan> *shotjyu*
* AkiFeather grins even wider at khan hehe
<Merticus> We don't talk enough to one another outside of these meetings...
<Gabriel> khan: hey I feel for ya bud.. I've had 'those' topics in here too
* Gabriel nods merticus
<LadyCG> We used to
<Merticus> Or maybe we do, some of us do I know, but as a general rule...
<Gabriel> merticus: please abstain from posting server/location as this is public
<LadyCG> talk outside the meeting, I mean.. we used to.. I liked it when we used to visit each others sites
<Raine> we should bump up the buddy thing as a priority
<Sylvere> Personally, I'm rarely online now that I'm back in college.
<Merticus> So how about a proposal
<Merticus> for weekly chats for those who are able to attend to be held either on IRC or
<Merticus> Yahoo chat interface. Many of us have YIM accounts or already see one another
<Merticus> on IRC but not all of us have added each other's names to our respective lists.
<Merticus> Talking between meetings not only will allow us to know more about one another
<Merticus> but also make us more aware of local events, situations that should be brought
<Merticus> to our attention, and generally build productive bonds between groups.
<AncientKhan> Please understand, folks, i'm just whole-heartedly against trying to write Vampire Law and pointing newbies to it.
<Lono676767> I can ussually be found on irc, ...my yim was eating my computer...
<Lono676767> trillian works wonders though
<AncientKhan> I'm open ti irc or YIM.
<Merticus> Gabe: por su puesta
<AkiFeather> nods trillian is good at combining the messengers and irc together into one program
<Gabriel> khan: it's not law
<Gabriel> khan: guidelines.. were not gods
<AncientKhan> You know what i mean
<LadyCG> just some safety reminders
<Merticus> And for that matter I'm of the personal opinion... call me crazy that all of us should be talking more often in the Community across the board. There are literally 50+ forums out there and hundreds of groups many of whom have no idea who operates/admins/mods/etc. the other.
<AkiFeather> nods
* AkiFeather is in Lady CG's board just doesn't post a lot lol
<Lono676767> nods
* Sylvere is nowhere due to University eating her brain
<Gabriel> lol
<Merticus> Seems like a core group that communicates with repetition but not enough branching/reaching out at times... course I might be biased on the subject.
<Raine> we could also update the intro page, and make it more of an interactive tour of the members
<AncientKhan> I am currently staying away from boards for the time beig.
<Gabriel> zombie university
<Imon> I am ignorant about IRC can you talk to individuals on it or just in a chatroom?
<Anshar> I think its a good idea, even as a bare backbone reminder that we do have moral compunctions, boundaries, and thoughts toward the same. The fact that we're willing to post ANY kind of ethical code is important. it shows our intentions. whether or not people should be "pointed" to it necessarily is another matter, but its one I think we can agree or disagree on at more length at a later date when they've been properly conceived.
<Lono676767> ?
<Sylvere> This is a bit off topic but still related...can we find a way to do a voice chat?
<LadyCG> I'll be more social again once I finish getting the S&M board fixed up. The move has left me having to replace all my graphics and skins and between that and work I've been swamped for almsot 4 months..
<Sylvere> That would free up hands for other things (like babies) and let slower typers keep up.
<AncientKhan> I am definitely up for voice or video conference.
<AkiFeather> voice chat is really difficult because of multiple people speaking at once
<AkiFeather> could get out of control very quickly
<Merticus> Voice is fine for me on this end, as is IRC, YIM, or any other interface.
<Lono676767> I'll be more social once I get my book finished up..
<LadyCG> I have a secret hate for voice chat... **whispers
<Gabriel> sylve: skype works nice
<Ravena> I raid in WoW with 20 people and we do ok
<Raine> I agree with voice or video, it would be less unorganized that way
<Ravena> we use vent
<Ravena> so it can be done, people just need to be polite
<Gabriel> we could hold a YIM chatroom
<Ravena> and there can be a system too
<Sylvere> EVE online has a group chat feature and it isn't terribly hectic
<Gabriel> that's voice
<Gabriel> so if you can't be heard you could type
<Merticus> Ok for the time being... 4.) Will everyone agree over the next week to add everyone else to their YIM/AIM/etc. contact lists and make attempts to chat more often between meetings and with others as time permits?
<AkiFeather> already on it Smile
<AkiFeather> lol
<LadyCG> I'm in favour of ANY kind of chatroom. I have a nice new flash chatroom, myself
<TTafk> as long as something is used that those of us that would prefer not to use voice is available.........my daughter is often around if i'm able to make a meeting
<Ravena> why not just set up a chat room or channel where people can drop by and shoot the breeze?
<Gabriel> I think it's a cool idea not only that but do hold the weekly (if ppl can make it) if not who cares
<Gabriel> at least it's there to be made
<Merticus> 5.) Do you agree we should hold weekly chats on let's say Sunday at 8 PM EST on either IRC/YIM? Yes or No?
<Sylvere> Can we get everyone to post their info to the Buddy List thread on Base if they haven't already?
* TTafk is now known as TwistedThorns
<Gabriel> yes
<TwistedThorns> yes
<Gabriel> sylv It may be a good idea to do a refresher
<Gabriel> new topic
<LadyCG> I agree to weekly chats
* Sylvere nods at Gabe
<AkiFeather> or maybe just keep this room open?
<Merticus> yes
<Gabriel> i'd love weekly chats
<AkiFeather> gabe and I usually idle in IRC
<Gabriel> Yim is more accessible i think
<Sylvere> I agree with weekly chats but probably won't attend due to school.
<Gabriel> nods to sylv
<Ravena> but easier to talk to everyone in here than holding five seperate conversations in different windows
<Merticus> Ok quick vote: 1.) IRC 2.) Yahoo 3.) Either (Doesn't Matter)?
* Lono676767 thinks about "fireside chats with the VVC"
<Merticus> 3
<Lono676767> lol
<TwistedThorns> 3
<Gabriel> 3
<LadyCG> 3
<Sylvere> 2
<Raine> I agree as well, though my availability will be limited on sundays
<Imon> 3
<AncientKhan> 2
<Raine> 2
<Lono676767> 3
<Anshar> 3
<Gabriel> think 2's win ;p
<LadyCG> I have YIM, IRC, MSN, java...
<Merticus> Tips in favor or IRC, however, don't want to leave out those who can't make it to IRC...
<AkiFeather> 3
<LadyCG> can't we rotate?
<TwistedThorns> have a chat time on both or rotate
<AkiFeather> though I'm not on Yahoo as much as I'm on IRC
<AkiFeather> not NEARLY lol
<Merticus> Perhaps start with IRC channel here with closed invite or rotate weekly as CG said?
<Gabriel> rotate might be better
<Gabriel> i personally like that idea of rotate
* AkiFeather nods
* TwistedThorns nods
<Merticus> All those in favor of rotate meeting IRC/Yahoo at 8 PM sunday - yes or no?
<Merticus> Weekly
<LadyCG> I have an irc channel and a flash chat room as well as a java interface for our IRC channel (so when its my turn to hostess you can take your pic, lol)
<TwistedThorns> yes
<LadyCG> Yes
<AkiFeather> yes
<AncientKhan> sure
<Ravena> yes
<Lono676767> why not
<Merticus> Ok let's set up next weekly chat on IRC at 8 PM - details can be e-mailed or on base.
<Imon> that's fine, put up a calendar maybe?
<Gabriel> 8pm? which time zone?
<Gabriel> lol
<Merticus> And don't forget to add everyone to your YIM/AIM/etc. - that way we can chat between times/find each other/etc.
<Merticus> EST
<Gabriel> ok
<AkiFeather> nods phpbb I think has a calendar function doesn't it?
<Merticus> You mean there is another :p?
<Gabriel> so 5 mine
<Gabriel> cool
<AkiFeather> or maybe not :/
<Gabriel> :p
<Merticus> Ok moving right along...
<Anshar> all my contact info is on the forum profile, if anyone needs it.
<Merticus> Community Announcements
<Gabriel> cool
<Gabriel> I'm having a baby
<Gabriel> er
<Gabriel> waits
<Gabriel> sorry
<Gabriel> go on
<Gabriel> ;p
<Merticus> Congrats Gabe Smile
<AkiFeather> hey now
<AkiFeather> they're all gonna think I'm pregnant
<Gabriel> it's a lil hard.. I don't know how the baby fits but ;p
<Gabriel> ok not really anyhow
* Gabriel listens
<LadyCG> I was jsut starting to wonder, Aki.. but thought you'd have told me. ;P
<Merticus> Well if everyone would be so kind as to take the time to finish their surveys... you should know the ones I'm talking about (both of them) and send them in we'd be very appreciative. We released preliminary sample charts 2 days ago... in the event you're interested.
<Gabriel> yeah
<AkiFeather> mert: are you still accepting the first at all? ><
<Sylvere> I got the first one done.
* Sylvere looks sheepish
<Gabriel> and those prelims rocked
<TwistedThorns> what surveys?
<Gabriel> very informative
<AkiFeather> I had it finished but by the time I was ready to send you were releasing prelim
<Gabriel> and interesting
<Merticus> We still have a March 31, 2007 + 1 month deadline - though as many as we can get in the sooner the better. Standing at 345 or so at present.
<AkiFeather> ok
<Merticus> Of course, we're still accepting both.
<AkiFeather> I got the 1st done and 2nd halfway
<AkiFeather> though I'm REALLY having to rethink some of my answers on the first after this weekend ><
<AkiFeather> lol
<TwistedThorns> i'm lost as to what is going on here now
<Sylvere> Mert: I am having trouble with the 2nd survey.
<Gabriel> Merticus are the prelims on your site yet?
<Merticus> The VEWRS & AVEWRS located at
www.vampiresurvey.com - charts I spoke of at are:
www.vampiresurvey.com/statistics.html (click to enlarge) - these are prelimary raw data charts based on 334 responses from March 22, 2006 to February 18, 2007.
<Gabriel> nice
<AkiFeather> TwistedThorns: Merticus put out 2 surveys for the vampire/energy workers community
<Sylvere> I don't consider myself and "energy worker" and don't do a lot of the stuff in the survey. My vampire feeding and "magical" ability is very instinctive. I have next to no training.
<Merticus> Sylvere - format issues or saving? Drop me an e-mail and we'll work it out.
<Merticus> Well, correction I didn't put them out. AVA did (of which I'm a part).
<AkiFeather> to collect data on demographics, believes abilities, magickal/non magickal background that may relate (ie - do energy workers or vamps share ocmmon interests, etc.)
<TwistedThorns> ok....thank you...now i'm not so lost
<AkiFeather> yw Smile
<Sylvere> I don't know how to answer some of the questions.
<Merticus> Ok np - just e-mail me and we'll go over or msg on YIM.
<Sylvere> ok
<AkiFeather> neither do I, and I'm definitely an energy worker... just having to re-think some of the other questions now o.O
<Merticus> I'll be back in Atlanta tomorrow and able to answer - on remote at moment.
<Gabriel> yeah
<Gabriel> some I didnt know how to answer
<Gabriel> and I bugged him on yahoo
<Gabriel> Smile
<Gabriel> then made fun of some of the questions... "memory loss"
<Gabriel> "I don't remember"
<AkiFeather> lol
<Merticus> Those unsure about you leave blank and/or answer to your default strongest inclination. We avoided the "I'm not sure" and "I don't know" to attempt to gather as many opinions as possible.
<Merticus> But in short - some interesting prelim results and data - take a look at statistics page and get them in to
response@vampiresurvey.com<Merticus> Next announcement...
<Merticus> House Kheperu Open House is June 22 - 24th in Medina, OH
<Gabriel> we'll try to be there
<AkiFeather> nods
<Gabriel> if money is ok'd
<AkiFeather> I'll have vacation time for it
<Gabriel> I may be giving a lecture at it
<Merticus> For those who have attended in the past you know what an interesting, educational, and enjoyable experience it is to be in a hotel with 50+ other vamps/energy workers.
<AncientKhan> Oh crap!
<AkiFeather> lol
<AkiFeather> Khan: pantheacon is worse... over 3000 ><
<AkiFeather> lol
<Gabriel> I think he was saying oh crap
<Gabriel> cause he forgot
<Gabriel> Smile
<AncientKhan> I meant gabe giving a lecture, dear.
<Gabriel> oh
<AkiFeather> oh wow
<Gabriel> BAH!
<Gabriel> ;p
<AkiFeather> hehe gabe that's encouraging :p
<AkiFeather> khan: don't mind me... getting close to time of needing food
<Gabriel> it's on Japanese alchohol
<Lono676767> hehe
<Gabriel> :p
<Gabriel> jk
<AncientKhan> Not sure if I can make this one. i do miss the staring...
<Lono676767> I'll be there
* Sylvere sniffles cuz I'm never gonna have $$ and childcare to come to the HK open house.
<Merticus> Information on the open house I assume with be posted on the Kheperu.org site - reservations, booking, etc.
<Gabriel> nods
<Gabriel> if you give a lecture or are picked for one the entrance fee is waived
<Merticus> Ok what other community announcements does everyone have? Local, national, international etc?
<AncientKhan> And you'rer giving a lecture on Japanese alcohol?
<Merticus> Any news, events, something we should be aware of... floor is open...
<Gabriel> Blood Moon Event October 26-29th
<Gabriel> Lake Tahoe
<Gabriel> 150.00 per person 50 deposit by May 15th
<Gabriel> Lodges on the beach
<Gabriel> Sat lectures - initiations
<Gabriel> Free shuttle from Airport to lodges
<LadyCG> S&M meetup June 23, 24, 25th this year here in Brooks
<LadyCG> if you're in Canada and up this way drop in
<Gabriel> nods
<LadyCG> wait.. 22, 23, 24, I think.. we're holding Solstice
<Gabriel> lol
<AkiFeather> lol
<Gabriel> hold solstice at the meetup
<Gabriel> ;p
<LadyCG> yes, exactly
<Merticus> Couple more... Black Oaks in Savannah, GA May 18th (Anders Manga and others will be playing). Beautiful city and local vamp community if you get a chance to visit.
<LadyCG> we do every year
<Sylvere> Midwest vampire/otherkin/goth meetup in Kansas City the 3rd Friday of every month.
<Gabriel> good to know
<Gabriel> got some peeps out in kansas
<Gabriel> that are friends
<LadyCG> I keep promising Sangi I"m make it down Kansas way some day
<Sylvere> Sangi is in this neck of the woods but she never shows up. *sniffle*
<Gabriel> We'll be doing meetups in Sacramento California first Sat of everymonth to be posted on next month as well
<AkiFeather> ndos
<AncientKhan> *imitates gabe* "I want to give a shout out to my G's in K-town..."
* Gabriel rofl khan
* AkiFeather laughs
<Merticus> Also DragonCon Aug. 31 - Sept. 3rd in Atlanta, GA, Belanger will be there with lectures again this year (details being worked out). DC is also the largest convention of its kind in the country...
www.dragoncon.org (trust me when I say if you can attend you should).
<Gabriel> Merticus is giving up his room to anyone who wants to stay with him.. Razz jk
<AkiFeather> rofl
<TwistedThorns> sorry folks...i need to go.
* TwistedThorns is now known as TTafk
* Gabriel bows to twisted
<AncientKhan> good eve, twist
<LadyCG> Have a good night TT
<Anshar> be safe Twisted
<Imon> g'night Twisted
<Sylvere> nighters
<TTafk> night everyone
<Lono676767> night
<Merticus> For those interested StrigoiVii launched their MySpace themed interface site at strigoivii.com... also having event in Paris coming up at Mussee de Vampiris (I butchered that I know)
<AkiFeather> nite Twisted
<LadyCG> did we cover everything for the meeting?
<Merticus> Funny Gabe
<Merticus> gn twisted
<Gabriel> Is it Todd ran or Strigoii?
<Merticus> Well it's the sanguinarium in general - few hundred people on the service (nice interface actually).
<Gabriel> ah either way they won't let me out of the country so ;
<Gabriel> p
<Merticus> Oh and no way I'm giving up my room this year... less you're "special" or provide benefits lol
<AncientKhan> And for just cause, gabe.
<Gabriel> khan ;p
<Merticus> What other news does everyone have locally? Or have heard of lately?
<Gabriel> merticus: I'll give you cake
<Lono676767> psivamp.org is now international and fully translated in german, on psivamp.net
<Gabriel> locally?
<Gabriel> well we have a new group that just started up looking forward to seeing what they have to offer
<Gabriel> we have a good amount of articles coming out tomorrow
<Gabriel> might be interesting to have a looksee
<Merticus> Anything on the national VC scene going on? Furtherdown is no longer active forum... any other forum news of note?
<Gabriel> not much
<Gabriel> OKA is looking at producing a book on otherkin
<Gabriel> if you have any input may wanna stop by and give some info
<Sylvere> Anyone know a guy called Grampa-E? He's starting a new house or something.
<Gabriel> yeah
<Ravena> yeah
<Anshar> yes
<Lono676767> nice
<LadyCG> S&Ms graphics are starting to look like home again, in case anyone wants to drop in and see what the YUKU system has to offer. Its a nicer interface since recent code pushes
<Sylvere> Who is he?
<LadyCG> I know Grampa E
<Gabriel> Grampa-e hangs out in Sangies channel a lot actually
<Sylvere> he wants to use my guidelines for his house.
<LadyCG> He and Lilith have started a new Coven up in there corner of Michigan
<Anshar> are there any other topics to be covered tonight? I'm pushing my time limit.
<LadyCG> I'll vouch for Lilith. I've known her for years
<Merticus> Nothing unless someone has something they'd like to bring up.
<Gabriel> I think were good
* Anshar nods and waits
* LadyCG is waiting for meeting to be over to cover goo
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