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Atlanta Vampire Alliance [AVA]  |  Vampires & Vampirism  |  Vampire Community & Subcultural Discussion (Moderators: Merticus, SoulSplat, Eclecta, Maloryn, Zero)  |  01.06.11 - An Open Letter To The Vampire Community - Zerochan 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
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Author Topic: 01.06.11 - An Open Letter To The Vampire Community - Zerochan  (Read 25028 times)
RKCoon
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« Reply #45 on: January 11, 2011, 09:34:46 am »

Zerochan nails it. Nicely done.
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Oblivionburns
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« Reply #46 on: January 11, 2011, 05:10:39 pm »

Cheri, I'll try to put this as simply as I can (may not do a very good job of it, but A for effort, right?):  rather that view the condition I'm in as a hindrance or something to be addressed as a hole that must be filled, I look at it as an advantage I have over those who do not have it.  I'm able to do things others can't or won't because I've recognized the causes & effects of the ability to move energy to where it's best put to use.  In my opinion there must be many who choose to be mundane by ignoring their own innate abilities, be they energy working, improved well-being through sanguinarianism, or any number of other suppressed talents.  In the same spirit I would consider donors of all kinds to be gifted in their ability to embrace, understand, & give of themselves that most intimate gift: their life force in whatever form.  In closing, please understand I actually do feel a bit sorry for people who think their own reality is the only one out there.  I realize my reality may not mesh up well with some others & I think there's good reason for us all being a bit different.  I feel sorry for those who ignore vampire reality in the same way I feel sorry for people who think AIDS is a scourge from God.  They're missing out on a hugely rich part of life that should be recognized & resourced.  And no, that doesn't mean I think everyone should be vampires.  I just don't think they realize how much the VC can enrich them.  That is a pity.
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Shadow hide you, moon watch over you, night cloak you, peace keep you.
Thought
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« Reply #47 on: January 11, 2011, 07:24:27 pm »

You don't accept YOURSELF, and therefore strive to have all of us change.

Love and respect yourself, and others will love and respect you.  Degrade and reject yourself and...fill in the blanks.
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iVamp : Ask me what kinds of Apps I come with.
LadyOfPales
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ITS A SPY


« Reply #48 on: January 11, 2011, 09:18:08 pm »

I want it. What about me?
Oh whoops, my opinion doesn't matter to people who want a vampire identity.
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>:|
Zerochan
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« Reply #49 on: January 11, 2011, 09:54:42 pm »

If you want it, fine. But those who do had better ensure it doesn't end up forced on the rest of us.
THAT is my problem with a "cure". Providing it's even possible for something I personally view as genetic.
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Darklilone
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Amelia Nightside


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« Reply #50 on: January 12, 2011, 02:53:57 am »

I don't feel that Vampirism makes who you are. Though i view it as a condition, you feel ill effects due to it, then you treat it (feed) and feel better.

I don't personally attribute any abilities or sensitivities to vampirism, other than perhaps a NEED to manipulate energy. but we mention all the time that ANYONE can learn to manipulate energy and become aware and sensitive to it. Vampirism does not give any special powers and does  not make you who you are. You will not change, if it is cured.
What about donors or finding your need (blood or energy) is it not difficult? do you ever wish there was an easier way?

at the very least, i would LOVE for a diagnosis, and official word to confirm it.. a cure would be great too, but if this is purely metaphysical (as some believe) then nothing physical can cure it.
If i had confidence that i knew what it was i suffer from, and readily had my need whenever i wanted/needed it, sure i'd be more comfortable with it, but nothing lasts forever, something always happens, i still think a cure would be a positive thing and would not take away anything that someone doesn't want taken away.
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RKCoon
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« Reply #51 on: January 12, 2011, 09:24:28 am »

.....Riiight. If you want a 'cure' go talk to wingedwolf and her tinfoil hat cure.
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Automotive Necromancer
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sorry, but my "Givafuk" is broken


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« Reply #52 on: January 12, 2011, 11:35:01 am »

why do many "psis" want the sangs to get cured?
Western Medicine has never been about "cures" only "treating /prolonging" (not enough cash flow in cures).

I would highly doubt any "cure" would ever be found , treatment maybe...
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Catori
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« Reply #53 on: January 12, 2011, 01:59:51 pm »

I have to agree. There are so many 'diseases' and such out there that have absolutely NO cure and never will. All that can be done is going through a life long treatment. Top it off folks, we do have big brother watching us. How many of you REALLY want to be on file as being labeled with a 'disease' that causes you to drink blood. Hmmmm? I know it is different in many ways, but is still a damned good example of what happens when big brother has too much of your information at his fingertips...

Unsuspecting Colorado residents were asked to have their dogs licensed which asked them to list the dog's breed or breeds on the paperwork. They thought nothing of it. I mean damn..it gave the place more money and it was something they felt needed to be done. So many good things could come of it. Finding lost dog's owners, making sure people kept up with medical care for poor helpless doggies. What could possibly go wrong huh? Heh, what went wrong is that all that information along with their addresses were at the governments fingertips. When Colorado made it illegal to own American Pit Bull Terriers, there was no grandfather clause in effect. So all those people thinking the licensing was a good thing had officers knocking on their doors after the law took effect. They all got to watch their PETS get drug out of their houses and killed on the spot if not taken away to be killed in mass. Then after watching all this unfold before their very own eyes, they were fined.

So I ask all of you, DO you REALLY want to go through the trouble of handing all your personal information over along with the fact you are receiving treatment or refusing treatment for drinking blood to where the good ole government has access to it? You know the government who has a penchant for pandering to the fearful masses in the most illogical ways such as comign up with band-aid fixes that tend to bring out the mob mentality in the good god fearing subjects? DO you want them to have access to all of that where they can make laws on a whim to take your children from you and refuse you to work in certain types of jobs or live in certain areas in order to appease their voting subjects who FAR out number all of us? Just a thought from someone who has battled many ill thought out laws coming from the government attempting to appease fearful voters who refuse to be educated and would rather eradicate or impart full government control over what they fear...
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CJ!
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« Reply #54 on: January 12, 2011, 02:33:32 pm »

Quote from: Zerochan
So what you're saying, is that you, personally, want a cure for sanguinarianism? Let's say hypothetically you found one, what then? Don't think for a minute that it wouldn't be forced on all sanguinarians. It would be the same as if they found a "cure" for homosexuality. After all, blood drinking is taboo. But then, what about the sangs who simply don't WANT a cure. What about those who have learned to thrive as what they are, and do not view this as a disability? I I certainly don't view it as such. I've learned to survive. The tone of the things you say however, screams that you haven't. You view your condition as an unfortunate hindrance, and obviously have not learned to thrive as who, and what you are. You don't accept YOURSELF, and therefore strive to have all of us change.

I feel my response to RK on the treatise thread basically answers all your questions.

Why Cure Sanguinarianism? (RKCoon)
A sanguinarian isnít what I am. A sanguinarian isnít who I am. It is just something extra I have to deal with: consume blood or pay the consequences. Although we may behave like an identity group I feel it is way too soon and rather pretentious to say that we are one. There are no hard facts about sanguinarianism yet. All we have is testimony and anecdotal evidence. There is nothing that confirms that sanguinarianism is necessarily a permanent condition although if we never get access to clinical trials that may end up being a self-fulfilling prophecy. Sanguinarianism isnít like homosexuality. The only detriment to being gay was the biases and prejudices of other people. Sanguinarianism have problems outside of social sentiment: if we donít feed, we get sick. Wouldnít it be nice to be rid of this extraneous need and the stigma that goes along with it? On the flipside, and speaking in a hypothetical situation given that clinical trials were done, should the medical and/or psychological community offer a treatment that seems worse than just managing my sanguinarianism, this could more solidify sanguinarianism as an identity.

I thought I was done and then I saw Sarah Palin's Nadia's post. It's as if she yanked the tinfoil hat off of WingedWolf's hat and decided to wear it herself. Using her logic one shouldn't seek treatment for depression, AIDS, STDs and any other disease which may have some stigma to it just because the evil government will use it against you.

Try again with no personal attack attached.

 Usually when there is more concrete evidence concerning a matter there is less opportunity to be creative enough to spark some sort of moral panic based on deception. This is more likely to happen the less we know about ourselves.
 
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Catori
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« Reply #55 on: January 12, 2011, 02:42:56 pm »

CJ!, there is nothing tinfoil about it...you are reaching. There is a huge difference between AIDS, STDS and so on and DRINKING BLOOD. The people at large were educated about all those sorts of thing, but still have to battle the religious freaks. DRINKING BLOOD...is going to have a much more negative effect as many have found out already. Increase it ten fold when it comes out that there ARE indeed people who feel a NEED to drink HUMAN BLOOD. Then add on the wannabe freaks who keep ending up in the media for murder and so on...you have a not so good chance to finding yourself not too far off from my example. IF, we did not have the huge problem of so much bad media hype against the community we MIGHT have similar response to the 'problem' as someone afflicted by AIDS. As it stands...we are viewed as mentally insane, cultish freaks preying on the innocent populace. Now..can you argue that without any personal attacks?
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Darklilone
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« Reply #56 on: January 12, 2011, 03:15:34 pm »

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why do many "psis" want the sangs to get cured?
I don't believe i targeted sangs or psis specifically, though a physical condition would be more likely to be treatable or curable than a metaphysical (if either is even real in the first place).

There are so many 'diseases' and such out there that have absolutely NO cure and never will. All that can be done is going through a life long treatment.
But there are people suffering from such 'diseases' who, i would think it safe to assume who don't use it as an identity, who don't cling to it, and if a choice were possible, would like to be rid of it.
I don't see much if any benefits from Vampirism (on either side of hte spectrum). All your abilities, relationships, even whatever tie you feel you ahve with the community, doesn't necessarily disappear or wouldn't. it would not change WHO you are, because WHO you are involves a lot more than some condition/disease/whatever.

I can understand if one has found a happy medium, a way to balance their need in their life and may not care one way or t he other (or apparently don't want a cure). But finding donors, wasting time and energy on getting what you need, be it in the past, now or in your future, is it not a hassle? The symptoms you feel when you don't get what you need, do you not suffer? That's all i understand Vampirism to be. A cure or treatment would be great, imo.

Quote
Top it off folks, we do have big brother watching us. How many of you REALLY want to be on file as being labeled with a 'disease' that causes you to drink blood.
That IS  a risk that i have not thought of, and a possiblity. As was mentioned with Western medicine and looking for money. It is a risk and while a cure, imo, would be favorable, there is risk in everything and if, by some chance it were available, i would think and hope that all seeking or receiving it would educate themselves properly and know what htey're getting into. Shit happens, i mean it sucks and no one wants that to happen, but how can you be sure something is a risk.
Does it seem like people with diabetes, cancer, even porphyria have that risk? They have just as much suffering, with seemingly no cure. Though, the blood drinking (or energy ability) is different, it still could bee seen as a disorder or whatever it is..What's wrong with that other than treating it? The Government sucks, but while they could turn around on blood drinkers, they could turn around on ANYONE for nearly ANYTHING, having a condition in which you need or believe you need blood, doesn't make it any more unique than anyone else suffering some other ailment, disorder or whatever..

We hand over our personal information all the time, doctor's offices, purchases, internet.. if the Govt. wants out identity and a reason to discriminate against us (or find us) i'm sure they have their ways already.


Quote
Usually when there is more concrete evidence concerning a matter there is less opportunity to be creative enough to spark some sort of moral panic based on deception. This is more likely to happen the less we know about ourselves.
Aren't a lot of Vampires (sang and psi) FOR getting tests and stuff done? aren't a lot of real vampires willing and desiring to learn more about  us/themselves and teach to others?
We're still learning a lot, and there's a lot TO learn. Who's to say we won't know more about it with time?

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Darklilone
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Amelia Nightside


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« Reply #57 on: January 12, 2011, 03:17:20 pm »

Quote
we are viewed as mentally insane, cultish freaks preying on the innocent populace. Now..can you argue that without any personal attacks?
can't WE change that?
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Darklilone
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Amelia Nightside


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« Reply #58 on: January 12, 2011, 03:25:33 pm »

You don't accept YOURSELF, and therefore strive to have all of us change.

(sorry for the triple post, either i'm REALLY blind lately or something in the forum has changed  Sad)

I hope the original poster and the recipient don't mind my using this (can provide a link to post if needed or request admin to delete), but i read this reply on another forum and must say that i agree.
Please keep in mind, just in case, i am NOT looking for conflict nor to start drama by bringing a discussion from one forum to another, however it was under a topic/thread about a cure, and we are currently discussing a cure.


Quote
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The way I see it, the only ones striving for a cure to vampirism are the ones who just can't accept it.


I can't relate to that statement at all. One might accept that they have, say, a disability, but that doesn't mean that one would not want to change that if it were possible to safely do so.

That statement sounds pro-staying-in-one's-comfort-zone. Or clinging to a vampire identity.
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CJ!
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« Reply #59 on: January 12, 2011, 03:28:59 pm »

Quote
we are viewed as mentally insane, cultish freaks preying on the innocent populace. Now..can you argue that without any personal attacks?
can't WE change that?

Bingo.

Another copypaste for you all.

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In short mainstream and to a certain extent scientific studies are sensational because we are sensational. We are the ones perpetuating the stereotypes. For example if one took a look at the roster of members at places like lesvampires and the VVC donít most of them aesthetically and in terms of beliefs professed appear that they fit right into the South Park gym bleacher vampire clique? The little progress the community has made was through very unsensational approaches. What got Joseph Laycock interested in the community were not our beliefs and gothy flair but the fact that a group commonly dismissed as a new religious movement actually initiated a survey to find out demographically who we really are. This is a social science example of the team effort that I am advocating. The reason Ryan Dube turned around was the quality of reasoned and grounded replies from those within the community. Judging by the transcripts he offers sympathy to the idea that what we describe as vampirism could be some sort of physical or psychological ailment explained by science; an unsensational reason. None of these efforts sparked some mass media extravaganza; our privacy is still intact. I just want to get in the position where those interested in investigating the world of ďreal vampiresĒ and by extension sanguinarians to find as little reason for sensationalism as possible and thus much reason to initiate further inquiry.

Don't blame the media and society. It's are own fault. And those calling for unity are the enablers. In fact Nadia's laughably hysterical rant feeds into such sensationalism.

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