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Atlanta Vampire Alliance [AVA]  |  Vampires & Vampirism  |  Vampire Community & Subcultural Discussion (Moderators: Merticus, SoulSplat, Eclecta, Maloryn, Zero)  |  A Sanguinarian Treatise: An Argument For Partition From The Vampire Community 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
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Author Topic: A Sanguinarian Treatise: An Argument For Partition From The Vampire Community  (Read 68807 times)
JayceeMoon
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Co-Founder of Order of the Raven


« Reply #30 on: January 03, 2011, 10:23:36 PM »

Ok, I have only one question for you...  First of all, let's start with your own words... below is a quote you wrote:

Quote
I myself am an “ex-hybrid.” I found the world of energy vampirism very early on in my realization that I was a sanguinarian (I called myself a vampire back then, I no longer call myself a vampire anymore for semantic and political reasons). I was quite freaked out at the bizarreness of the realization and at the thought that for the rest of my life I would have to consume blood if I no longer want to be consumed by the hunger, lethargy, and sensual sensitivity that I have in the past taken for granted. I was quite desperate for any substitute for that dire fate and was willing to accept nearly anything that seemed reasonable. I was taught energy feeding and eventually taught it to others, whether vampire identified or not, since anyone can do it. The energy feeding was quite effective for me, and the subjects I was teaching the energy feeding to could feel the energy course through them. Two or three years later I disavowed any belief in the existence of psi/chi/prana/etc.

If you started out as a psi-vamp, experienced it yourself, and admittedly fed that way for years... you even took it to the point of being able to teach others how to feed from energy so that others could "feel the energy course through them"... then how in the world can you "disavow" any belief in the existence of psi/chi/prana/etc???  You are a walking contradiction.

As far as your statement about sanguinarians being easier to "test study," that is probably true.  But that doesn't "lessen" the way any psi, pranic, tantric vampyre feeds.  But in all reality, real vampyres are already segregated enough, no matter what "type" of vampyre you are, and we are even more segregated from the rest of the world who do not understand the physical need that vampyrism causes...  So what exactly do you hope to gain in segregating the vampyre community even more than it already is???  Is it not in our best interests to come together and educate the world about us... about all of us...

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Jurence
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« Reply #31 on: January 03, 2011, 10:25:42 PM »

This entire situation is so dumb from a third party perspective.
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JasonConstantine
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« Reply #32 on: January 03, 2011, 10:28:10 PM »

Its been a while since I have posted and I have been lurking from time to time around here just to see whats going on. This post came to my attention from a friend and being ronin nowadays I dont know why I feel I have to speak out on this ....

Firstly let me say its an extremely well written post, unfortunately that is where my appreciation for it ends.

Next I think you should know that for my first 10 or so years in the Vampire community I was one of those "Psi / Hybrid" "vampires" you seem to have an issue with. Now I am strictly Sanguine in my feeding practices not by choice but by necessity. While I do applaud your efforts for attempting to rid the negative stigma that surrounds the "vampire" community and the term "vampire" in general, I believe you are going about it in the completely incorrect fashion.

Being a member of the "vampire" community since the mid 90's when it all came in to "vogue" publicly, I have seen the rifts the differences of opinions of it members creates. That being said the main issue with the community today is the "I am king hear me roar" syndrome. So with this being said I pose a few questions .....

What makes you think separating Sanguine's out from the rest of the community will make it any better? The Nazi's tried to segregate themselves from the rest of the Germans and look where they ended up.

What makes you think that segregation is the answer? Wouldn't just having the community as a whole drop the entire "vampire" moniker be better for everyone? No more Twilight or Anne Rice fans claiming they are some sort of royalty or deity. No more people claiming to be at war with the Lycans or being Daywalkers. Personally i think we should move toward the latter.

Just my 2 cents .....
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« Reply #33 on: January 03, 2011, 10:34:40 PM »

i agree jason...

im a blood drinking tele-tubby btw...
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JasonConstantine
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« Reply #34 on: January 03, 2011, 10:38:43 PM »

Quote
i agree jason...

im a blood drinking tele-tubby btw...

Really! DUDE THATS AWESOME!
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paindancer
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« Reply #35 on: January 03, 2011, 11:01:51 PM »



Assigning incredulity, mechanisms, and “Eastern science” (Paindancer)
For the purposes of scientific study the claims of the psi vampire are incredulous. A scientific mind isn’t going to buy a necessary premise on faith alone. It is also quite interesting that you brought up mechanisms as a strength for psi theory. I actually see it as a weakness. Since psi/chi/prana/etc is intangible theories and mechanisms are as far as psi can go. Since blood is tangible sanguinarians do not need pet theories. The facts are out there. It is just up to us to put ourselves in the best position to obtain them. In the meanwhile the best answer for us is “I don’t know.”
   Science is science regardless of geography. Perhaps you meant Eastern philosophy. I analogize the inventions of vital energies as akin to Judeo-Christian creation theories. As we have progressed with our knowledge in medicine and the natural world, such antiquated ideas are really of no use anymore as universal fact. However if it is in part of a personal spiritual persuasion which enriches one life perhaps such ideas could be useful.


But a mechanism would still exist.  If there is some chemical 'X' in human blood that you lack or gives you extra ability 'A', that, for some reason defies mass balance issuses.. then yes, that can be worked with.

To date, I do not believe anyone has even been able to prove feeding gives anyone extra ability 'A' or what extra ability 'A' even is.  When I feed, for example, I am greatly less in pain and my body dosnt feel like I am a left handed glove on a right hand.  But that is totally subjective and useless when it comes to proof.

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Paindancer
Advocating sensible vampirism since 2006
vampirengel666
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As above, so below


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« Reply #36 on: January 03, 2011, 11:18:21 PM »

This has been mulling around in my cranium all day, and quite frankly I have a headache now thankyouverymuch.  Sadly this kind of post is one of the main reasons I choose not to engage within the OVC.  Seriously? This community was built on the foundation of Psi and Sang vampires joining together, not trying to prove who is better than the other. Personally I am one who believes that all vampires are the same in their need for prana, but the METHOD at which we come to that means determines what we call ourselves (whether it be Sang, Psi, Elemental, Empath, etc.).  These posts bashing one half of the community or the other seem to be stemmed from egotistical and narcisistic insecurities within individuals.  If you are not happy with who or what you are, too bad - don't take it out on me.  I've also noticed that some who have come out to the media have done so profusely.  Again, these individuals have an ego that screams for attention, and could potentially threaten the stability of this community.  

I miss the days when it wasn't all so complicated.  I wish I could say that we should "all just get along," but that of course would be impossible.

Get off your pedestal, we're all in this together.
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"That is not dead which can eternal lie, and with strange eons even death may die."
theUVUP
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Rev. JP Vanir


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« Reply #37 on: January 04, 2011, 12:22:59 AM »

WOW, Im not really here I am just a figment of everyones imagination LOL. I know If only, kidding. I believe quite the opposite that all Vampyres (are born) have the ability to feed in all ways but most chose a preferred or easiest to achieve method of feeding. THAT IS JUST MY PERSONAL OPINION and am not going to tell you you do not exist because you choose to believe differently. We are all free to believe what we wish or are able to.
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Oblivionburns
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« Reply #38 on: January 04, 2011, 01:32:39 AM »

I agree, Father JP!  Some in the community are getting sidetracked from the prime objective:  we should feel FREE.

As we bicker away, nit-picking points & pigeon-holing/typing we lose sight of what it means to be what we are.  None of us have any ability to dictate what causes another's needs or methods of feeding.  Safety first & let's LIVE!
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Darklilone
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Amelia Nightside


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« Reply #39 on: January 04, 2011, 02:50:01 AM »

i don't have time to read through all of the replies right now.
however i wanted to reply.

first off, about the agenda.. he mentioned quite clearly that his intentions for writing it are selfish. I would assume that means he has an agenda.

also,
Quote
"psi feeding" that does not involve "concentrating on the source and remove all other things from your mind, then feel the energy moving over.

I actually just experienced this last night. For the first time in my life i fed off someone in person and they were able to confirm it.
I was not focused on her, i was not clearing my mind, it was not meditative.
i was sitting, if a little anxious as this was only my second time meeting her, and we were having a conversation. my mind was focused on what was said and what i was going to say.
I felt what i believe to indicate that i was pulling energy. Part of me, as i always do, wanted to stop it, but i let it continue.. I wondered if it was real, if i was just anxious and experiencing my gut tense up or if i was imagining it..
She wound up stopping me, mid thought, and said something to the effect of "by the way, you've been taking a LOT of energy from me". When i reacted with "i'm sorry" and tried to indicate i'd try to stop, she said it was ok.
My friend last night, has stated that she has fed both sang and psi, and finds blood to be better for her.

Most of hte time when i feel like i'm taking energy there is no one, in person, to verbally confirm it to me. most of the time, ifi feel it, because i hate doing it, i will mention to whoever i'm talking to that i could be drawing and apologize if i am, and often ask that they protect themselves from it if they don't want it as i try to stop it.
I was not focused on my "source" i was focused on the conversation. I did not clear my mind, granted i also did not feel the energy flowing through me, as it's often described, but i could feel that i was pulling it into myself, and she was able to identify and confirm (without any indication of it from me previously) that she could feel her energy being drawn from her.
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childofthespiral
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Twitter.com/wolfeloin


« Reply #40 on: January 04, 2011, 03:08:43 AM »

That's similar to how I was able to confirm what I am. My husband has known for a while what I am. However whenever we've planned for me to get energy, he swears he cannot feel it. Yet there have been a few times when I wasn't watching what I was doing and suddenly he will look at me and say "honey, you're taking a little too much energy from me".                                                 
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After a long and painful absence, I am finding my way once more back to the arms of Goddess.
deacongray
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« Reply #41 on: January 04, 2011, 10:01:55 AM »

Well for a moment lets take away the US against THEM thought process. If you believe you have a blood disorder that can be treated if it can be identified, then it would only seem logical to do everything within your power to get it identified and treated. What wouldn't be logical is putting the term vampirism into the mix if you want doctors to take it seriously.  Telling a doctor that you crave blood and think it might be caused by some kind of a blood disorder...well that is a lot more reasonable.

There are after all a lot of blood disorders, and considering the amount getting the basic testing done, and perhaps looking to see if there are others isn't unreasonable.  (  link to list of blood disorders) http://www.telemedicine.arizona.edu/patient_info/benign_disorders/alpha_list.html

I don't see it as a US vs Them.                                   
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LadyOfPales
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ITS A SPY


« Reply #42 on: January 04, 2011, 12:36:03 PM »

ITT
metaphysical ass pain
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>:|
paindancer
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« Reply #43 on: January 04, 2011, 12:41:15 PM »

Interesting take grey.  Of course the assumption being that this an medical condition.
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Paindancer
Advocating sensible vampirism since 2006
giselle
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To help communication between vampire & donor.


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« Reply #44 on: January 04, 2011, 04:01:34 PM »

Here is my two cents on the subject: I think sangs need heme. I believe a healthy sang donor's system process heme to a form the sang can use. I have worked in surgery in 15 years and have seen how blood supports life. Been a sang donor for over 5 years now. Have seen the physical changes in the sangs skin tone,eye color and energy level. Do I think this can ever been proved? More than likely not.  Just remember this Osmosis (spelled wrong) is the area of greater concentration moving to an area of lesser concentration.  Matter being blood, energy or whatever obeys this physiology rule. 

My question is WHY does it matter? Is it to prove to  "regular" society, "Hey, look I have a legit reason to be a vampire." To make it known you are not crazy because you drink blood? How is different than eating beef or chicken? one way it can be looked at is you are eating animal flesh. Why can not PSI and Sangs BOTH be vampires? Everyone's body has a their own special way of processing what we put into into our bodies to be at optimal health. One of the many reasons there is not one pill or one set of prodicals to cure everyone of any dieases they may have.
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Sang Donor/Emapth
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