AVA Main Directory | Resource Links | Event Calendar | Vampirism Research Study | Archived AVA Forum v1.0





Atlanta Vampire Alliance [AVA]
User Info
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
October 24, 2020, 07:51:54 PM

Login with username, password and session length
Search:     Advanced search

Key Stats
19898 Posts in 2604 Topics by 1004 Members
Latest Member: DragonBLood
Home Help Arcade Login Register
Atlanta Vampire Alliance [AVA]  |  Therianthropy & Otherkin  |  Therianthropy & Were (Moderators: Merticus, SoulSplat, Eclecta, Maloryn, Zero)  |  Therianthropy? 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. « previous next »
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 Print
Author Topic: Therianthropy?  (Read 23390 times)
RKCoon
*
Level 5 Contributor
*
Gender: Male
Posts: 460



« Reply #15 on: September 24, 2010, 04:52:34 AM »

Both. Given what you have titled yourself, I find the claim that you research and think for yourself, rather hollow.
Logged

Automotive Necromancer
The Sentinel
Level 4 Contributor
****
Gender: Female
Posts: 127


The Thread Zombie


WWW
« Reply #16 on: September 24, 2010, 12:58:37 PM »

What have I titled myself? Someone who has their BA?

And you can question whether or not I think for myself, the opinions of one internet goon won't really sway the overall arc of my studies and frankly, you aren't even really offering me any information I can use. Nor have you in the entire time I've bothered to read your posts so... Really... I'm just going to go back to doing what I was doing before: pretending you don't exist.

Edit: Oh wait that was an underhanded and sneaky comment about my being Christian. Priceless.
Logged

A little learning is a dangerous thing; Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring.
-- Alexander Pope, Unknown , 1688-1744

Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.
-- Heinlein's Razor
RKCoon
*
Level 5 Contributor
*
Gender: Male
Posts: 460



« Reply #17 on: September 24, 2010, 07:51:19 PM »

Nothing underhanded nor sneaky about it.    Surprised it took you a second chance to get the reference however.
Logged

Automotive Necromancer
Darklilone
Level 5 Contributor
*****
Gender: Female
Posts: 260


Amelia Nightside


WWW
« Reply #18 on: September 24, 2010, 08:02:52 PM »

RK, look. i really don't care if you believe in a religion or not. that's your choice. but to target another, and claim such things and USE their beliefs and religion against them...
That's just not right.
I don't even know what to say but i wanted to say something.
Take offense all you want, attack me if you care.
I've not had much if any problems with you around here till now.
i've respected your opinions and found your "shit stirring" on occasion to be interesting and thought-provoking..
I guess everyone has a first, huh. i guess i'm just disappointed, though i should have expected it.

Now, back ON to the topic, i hope..  -_-
**i'm sorry that i don't have really anything further to add to the original topic, atm .
Logged
RKCoon
*
Level 5 Contributor
*
Gender: Male
Posts: 460



« Reply #19 on: September 24, 2010, 08:15:51 PM »

Ahh, but lets consider that a moment, darklilone -- To me, (and I will grant my logic isnt always flawless) it seems to be a logical fallacy to insist that one is an open minded self thinker, when one freely admits to adhering a two milenia old scripture that has long since proven to be chock full of historical errors, moral atrocities and outright evil, by any definition, is, to me, a grievous error in judgment, if not outright hypocrisy.  Further, I dont feel attacked at all by your comment, dark - but I am quite certain sentinel does.

All this comes back to the original point I was intending to make to sentinel - far too often I have personally seen people be led down the garden path, both regarding religion and kin, because they would rather `take someone`s word for what they are`than to seek the truth for themselves. People are far too eager to take something and say, `thats me!`rather than actually examine what it is they are looking at. Christianity is a classic example, requiring many multiple `leaps of faith`to subscribe to belief - whereas something like therianthropy or even vampirism, while still taking some `leaps of faith` i will concede, is nowhere near a stretch that religion, christianity and otherwise, is.  Sentinel demonstrated this twice over - in her faith in religion, and her faith of what others have told her, of herself.

I, personally, can admit to being wrong, if someone can rationally, logically, reasonably explain and demonstrate to me my error. People like sentinel, however, are not capable of that - and if you want to call that an attack, be my guest, but it wont change the accuracy of the statement.
Logged

Automotive Necromancer
Darklilone
Level 5 Contributor
*****
Gender: Female
Posts: 260


Amelia Nightside


WWW
« Reply #20 on: September 24, 2010, 08:25:18 PM »

Look, that's your opinion.
if someone has claimed a set of beliefs, can you not hope, or assume that they may have done their own research and wanderings and maybe they've managed to see soemthing that you've missed or overlooked?
Not all religions are bad. There are individuals who over-do it, i wont' disagree. but i don't see it as failed judgment or anything based on a couple, unrelated individuals.

>.< i really don't want to go into religion and the bible (christian). i've done some studies but not enough to keep my own in a conversation. I know enough and i'm satisfied with the information i've attained.
You're just being closed-minded and disrespectful towards someone who claims a religion, when you do not and disagree with their claims.
this thread was about her, therianthropy and her wonderings about it. NOT "let's attack each other's beliefs because we want to fuel our egos".

I just don't like it and would prefer that you cease completely or move it to pms. really.

*edit*
you're just as bad as those individuals though. They claim others as being wrong for not following their beliefs. you're claiming they're wrong for following their beliefs. and, like them, you refuse to see another side of things, and seem to present yourself as the all knowing, end all person.. Which you're not.
yes i've enjoyed some of your posts in the past.
yes i feel you offer another perspective to most things, which is great.
but this is just disrespectful. it's not offerign another perspective it's low, it's ignorant, arrogant, and it's mean. You're no better than those you claim to hate. You're just on the other side.
Logged
display
*
Level 5 Contributor
*
Gender: Male
Posts: 231


sorry, but my "Givafuk" is broken


WWW
« Reply #21 on: September 24, 2010, 08:34:28 PM »

Koon,
  It seems You are the only one to think this of sentinal.
I haven't read any other opinions about her yet, you are the only one to have such opinion... Its really sad that You constantly bring up  others members religion... I'M a CHRISTIAN So what ?...

Should I now Bow down and Kiss your arse oh great and powerful Vampire God?
Hell no!
Grow up will ya? Get what ever or how ever big, Cob out of your ass ... But this is just my opinion you know and not everyone will agree with me (even though most will)
Don't be offended Dear OZ,
Prove it wrong your not a DICK all the time
Logged
The Sentinel
Level 4 Contributor
****
Gender: Female
Posts: 127


The Thread Zombie


WWW
« Reply #22 on: September 24, 2010, 08:46:42 PM »

Thank you Dark Li'l One and Wraiths, I appreciate it. The intent of this thread was purely to gain information from other people that may be therianthropes out there and help give me perspective on what, exactly, it means and whether or not I fit that classification. I have no intent of dragging religion into this because it has no bearing on it whatsoever.
Logged

A little learning is a dangerous thing; Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring.
-- Alexander Pope, Unknown , 1688-1744

Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.
-- Heinlein's Razor
display
*
Level 5 Contributor
*
Gender: Male
Posts: 231


sorry, but my "Givafuk" is broken


WWW
« Reply #23 on: September 24, 2010, 08:54:26 PM »

No worries hun... Most likely I will get some type of censure about my last post..

Logged
Merticus
House AVA Founder
Administrator
Level 5 Contributor
*****
Gender: Male
Posts: 1651



WWW
« Reply #24 on: September 24, 2010, 09:07:00 PM »

Play nice and try to not personally offend others... at least the best you can.  Thank you!
Logged

RKCoon
*
Level 5 Contributor
*
Gender: Male
Posts: 460



« Reply #25 on: September 24, 2010, 09:17:42 PM »

Ahh yes, i see my point has been missed, well, once more with feeling.

Darklilone - Quite true, everyone is allowed to believe as they wish, and I certainly am not preventing sentinel, or anyone else for that matter, from believing whatever they want - I am simply endeavoring to keep things as clear and straight as possible, while noting aloud that i found her claims to be rather double standard ish. And you are also correct - everyone has an opinion, and if people dont like mine, they certainly dont have to read it - yet people do seem to read mine all the time.

Wraiths - Im not asking nor telling anyone to do anything at all. Im simply, as stated previously, pointing out my opinion, as someone who has been around the block more than once or twice.  That said, why should *I* play nice to someone who is not getting the hint, or those that would jump to the defense of a rather questionable position? Further, why is it that I am being told to grow up, when all I am doing, is asking sentinel to think for herself? I was unaware that was such a crime. I wont deny being a bit of a dick sometimes (and a bitch) but it would seem that I am currently in good company.  It takes one to know one, perhaps?  Although, I will admit, I find it rather amusing that instead of, as I previously asked for, people using logic, reason or rationality to counter my points, I instead get personal attacks. Quite amusing, actually.

Sentinel - Actually, it does, if by extension.  Again to repeat myself, both are things that 'take faith' to believe in. My entire point was to get you to not be so quick on the faith, but rather, think about what you see, what you are told, and what you believe, rather than taking it at face value. However, I have yet to see you do so, and that was what I was noting.

Mert - please, people find my mere presence offensive. Wink
Logged

Automotive Necromancer
Darklilone
Level 5 Contributor
*****
Gender: Female
Posts: 260


Amelia Nightside


WWW
« Reply #26 on: September 24, 2010, 09:34:55 PM »

is asking sentinel to think for herself?

Then perhaps you should try a better approach. there are countless words in existance, and nearly that many ways to put them.
you would probably get a better, and more willing response from people.
just saying, though..




*silly edit*
Post number 123 ! ^_^
Logged
Taris
Level 3 Contributor
***
Gender: Male
Posts: 97


Feel free to contact me for discussions.


WWW
« Reply #27 on: September 24, 2010, 09:39:58 PM »

I dont believe it is your presence that is offensive RK. I think it is more how you go about the conversation and tend to bring unnecessary topics into it. You work the conversation towards argumentative more than constructive in most of the posts. You say things that can and most likely will be taken offensively and do it constantly. Your opinion of whether or not she is being blindly led when you dont know whether or not she is isnt a educated conclusion its an assumption about her character and unrelated to the topic at hand.

Avoiding topics that have nothing to do with the post such as her religion would have eliminated a large portion of the argument I see. Personally, I dont see a point in feeding it which is why im not taking the stand of "Go Off yourself you Arsehole". But the conversation could have remained a conversation instead of an argument if you had simply decided not to bring it there.

It wasnt necessarily an attack... But it could be seen as one considering the content.

Anyway back to being non existent.
Logged

Going back into the shadows again. Hope those within the community can solve what needs to be solved and those new to it can handle it or run while ya can lol.

Back somewhat but still determining if things are fixed >.> XD Can contact me via PM for discussion or hit me up on facebook.
The Night Watchman
Level 2 Contributor
**
Gender: Male
Posts: 12


Empathic energy vampire


« Reply #28 on: September 24, 2010, 10:40:51 PM »

You know, I'm seeing a lot of pointless condescending comments here and frankly I find it to be sad.  Allow me to approach this with points, if I may:

1) Religion:  Explain to me just what is wrong with having faith and belief in something bigger than yourself.  Most everyone is on this site because they are, or truly believe in, something that is above and beyond the normal everyday things that humanity sees with it's eyes and accepts as the norm.  In a world where the nerds have finally won, and where media is filled with magic, mythical creatures, and one ring that rules them all, it's damn hard to truly be who we are because you can't just want up to a normal individual and say "Hey, I'm a vampire," "Hey, I'm part wolf," or "I can project my spirit to another plane of existence," without you being laughed at.  Hell, there has been very few points in history where such things were readily accepted as anything other than heresy and that you wouldn't be ostracised or burned at the stake for.  So why is believing in a spirit, energy, god or any other such thing a bad idea or an act of selfless blind following? 

Now believe me, I am very much against the idea of religion in and of itself.  I consider myself Christian because I have a personal relationship with my god.  Is he your god?  Sentinels god?  Wraiths god?  Maybe, and maybe not.  However, this is where the topic of religion is often clouded and misunderstood.  The difference is between the ideas of "religion" and "faith".  I believe that organized religion can be a good and bad idea.  It is not a bad thing for people of similar belief to want to gather together and unite in their faith.  Also, church (for some communities) is the center of their community and do a lot of good to bring people together to help themselves and others.  However, lets take a look at how many times in history religion has poisoned minds.  Belief and organization of followers under those beliefs can lead to destructive things.  Look at what's going on in the world right now.  The Jihad?  And what about a little overlooked point in history called The Crusades?

I believe "faith" is a personal and internal thing.  Religion, as it's all often placed under the title of, is a fickle thing.  You will never find any two people with identical views on their belief and faith.  Even people of the same church each have their own ideas on how things work and their own faith in it.  Faith is personal.  Faith is internal.  Between you and whatever god or spirit you decide to believe in.

I am not religious.  I don't attend church, I don't go to confession, and I certainly enjoy a good steak on Fridays without being told I'm not allowed to for Lent.  But in my heart, I believe that there is something larger than me out there overseeing things and guiding me.  I have spoken to him, I have relationship with him, and in times that I have needed help when help seemed beyond me, asking for help seemed to have paid off.

I bring this up because I want to say that, yes, there are those that blindly follow religion like sheep.  Some out of ingnorance, some out of necessity.  Again, I refer to some of the Islamic extremists.  A man living in a 3rd world country, completely poverty stricken with absolutely nothing has someone with power or money come and spin tales of a god.  That if you strap a bomb to yourself and go walk into a building not only will your family be taken care of for the rest of their lives, but when you die you will be granted riches and praise in heaven forever.  How could you possibly pass up such a thing?!  You have such a strong need to believe this that you would do anything they ask of you.  However, that having been said, don't lump all people with faith into the same boat.  Some, like me, are not blind followers lead by some unseen herder.  Sentinel never said her faith is blind nor that she follows religion absolutely without understanding.  I know for fact that she actually wasn't religious at all until she took a college course on the break down and study of the bible and then decided, for herself, that she liked some of the ideals and then formulated her own personal idea of what that religion is, and developed her own faith and relationship with her god.

2) Sentinel has very specifically said that she is trying to figure out where she lies on the scale of totem, therian, or any other possible thing.  I don't know, Coon, where you're getting that she is blindly and blatantly following what others have told her without formulating her own ideas.  She is, by far, the most brilliant and logical human being I have ever known in my life.  Sentinel never walks into a single thing in her life without weighing the options and deciding what would be best for her or those around her.  All she did say is that she has formulated certain understandings of some things based on what she has been told or has researched herself over time, but that she is trying to work it out for herself exactly what it is she feels or is. 

She directly asked for others to explain their views and opinions about what she described so that she can gain a broader understanding of how others understand or experience the ideas of totemic belief, therianthropy, or maybe even something she hadn't considered yet.

We have, pretty much, all gone to school right?  Do you call your fellow students blind for believing the teacher when he said that 2 + 2 is 4?  Do you call other students sheep for believing a teacher when they said they have had a personal experience that leads them to believe X?  No.  We take in the information, consider it, and then decide for ourselves if it's right (when dealing with opinion topics) or assimilate the information into our knowledge when dealing with factual topics (such as math).

Sentinel is, and has stated, that she feels and believes a certain way in her life and would like to know what others think.  It is a very simple and direct thread that she started and I think it has been read far too much into.  The poor girl didn't come here to be criticized and put down.  She just wanted some understanding of fact or opinion from others that she might consider and decide "That actually makes sense to my situation" or "That doesn't seem right, I'll keep thinking on it and researching". 

3) Coon, directly to you, I know you may not feel that you have been insulting or harping, but you went after someone that you do not know and that you have almost no knowledge of when it comes to their beliefs, ideas, faiths, or methods.  I'm sorry to have to say it, but that was very short sighted and outright uncalled for.  Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this forum intended to be a haven for those with less than conventional beliefs to get together and have others to turn to for information or understanding?

What's more, you seem to not only be against the idea of religion as a whole, but also against the idea of faith specifically.  If you live your life without belief (at all) that there is something more to this world and our lives than just our sad, fragile sacks of meat wandering this rock then I believe that to be a hollow and shallow existence.  If this is the case, sir, I truly feel sorry for you.

4) Now I am an energy vampire and an empath, but the truth of it all is that the entire world of metaphysics and things outside of the normal view of reality is very new to me.  I have just begun to scratch the surface of trying to analyze and understand all of the strange things in me and what I am.  Sentinel has been my guide in this and, believe me, she knows what she's talking about.  No, she doesn't know all there is to know and this is why she seeks information and understanding from others to try and formulate her own ideas of who and what lies beneath the surface.  As for me, I am very animalistic in nature.  Territorial, dominant, I bite, I growl, I stalk... I have a strong affinity for and close connection with wolves and tigers.  I always have.  It has been suggested to me that I may have wolf and tiger totems, or that I may even be a -thrope of some kind.  Who knows?  Certainly not me, nor Sentinel.  She has only suggested that these are possibilities and that I, much like herself, research and look inside myself to decide the answers on my own.  After all, who can know you inside better than you?

I think that we all have a lot to look for inside.  No one ever knows themselves fully and there are always new things to find hiding beneath the flesh.  Be sure to keep your heart and mind open in a place like this.  We're all here to try and find ourselves through support and information from others that may be like us.  This world frowns on us enough as it is, so lets try not to frown on one another.

Take care, all of you.  I extend my thanks to those who have offered their honest intent to try and help Sentinel, because you also have helped me since I am on similar quests for understanding.
Logged

"Legend tells that we are unable to cast reflection, my dear.  Do you have any idea what manner of pain in the ass that would be?" ~Chase
RKCoon
*
Level 5 Contributor
*
Gender: Male
Posts: 460



« Reply #29 on: September 24, 2010, 11:53:18 PM »

Faith, in and of itself, is fine. Its blind faith I have a problem with, a big one.  When someone says they are a christian (for example), I immediately write them off; they are stating "I am blind to the lies, the hypocrisy, the crimes, the evils wrought not just by others of the faith, but those that the faith claims its own god has done." You yourself, watchman, even hint at being at the very least peripherally aware of some of such evils, yet you would associate yourself with it anyway.

Plain and simple.  My entire point, to say this for the third time now, was to encourage sentinel and others to NOT take things blindly, but to examine for themselves what it is they are putting faith in.  People get bent right out of shape when I state what I say and how i say it, rare it is when I see them actually stop for a minute and examine what it is I say, and moreover, WHY I might say it.  I can stand my ground all day and all night long, immobile and unflappable, because I KNOW there is no logical, rational, reasonable way for ANY christian, ANY religious person to convince me of their beliefs, because I KNOW there exists no logical, rational ,reasonable backing TO what they believe - yet they persist, blindly - and, ironically, condescendingly.

As an aside, am I the only one that catches the further irony of me getting chewed on for what I believe, because it goes against the grain of others? And yet when I find others beliefs offensive, I am  supposed to keep quiet?

Pffft, theres a laugh.
Logged

Automotive Necromancer
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 Print 
« previous next »
Jump to:  

Powered by SMF 1.1.4 | SMF © 2006-2007, Simple Machines LLC
Copyright 2005-2012 | Atlanta Vampire Alliance | All Rights Reserved
Theme By Nesianstyles | Buttons By Andrea | Modified By Merticus